Middle sword Strat- herik

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herik
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Middle sword Strat- herik

Post by herik »

Hey everyone, since coming back. I wished that I had written everything down that I did know before and when playing mid sh with swords. I'll be posting my civ/strat/tips and tricks that I used to use when I played a lot faster and smarter. (From memory of course). This is written for everyone, even the noobs, so expect details.
Your classic Civ:
Building: cr, btd
Cit: speed
Economy: Hunting/foraging, Iron mine
Sword: attack, speed, hp, btd, cr
Seige: range

(When I write a single capital letter (apart from a or I...It will mean a Hotkey))
This strat will be based on a average map we're no double mines will are located, has 2 hippos and a grove of hunt etc
My strat: When screen loads mouse hits middle of screen. Hover finger over H, Boom game starts. Press H, Press shift C while eyes are checking out minimap for best mines. Press TAB, SHIFT TAB x 6, while moving mouse so closest iron mine. TAB, Shift TAB x 6, and find 2nd closest iron mine.
Pick sword civ
TAB, SHIFT TAB x3, press B (make all barracks close to capital)
TAB, SHIFT TAB x 3, Press B make barracks..
TAB, SHIFT TAB x 2 ,Press B make barracks..3rd cit will have arrived, while they walk to make 3rd, shift tab and order that cit to make barracks aswell.
Group first 3 cits you ordered to make barracks, press T, and shift mouse click at closest iron (makes them do a 2nd task after finished with first)
H
Group 2nd group of cits, repeat and put at 2nd iron mine
H
Group 3rd group cits shift click T to make at forage
H
double click 2-3 barracks press S and rally at enemies iron most likely mine they would go on mini map
Press H, make 2 more cits, rally capital to closest tree
Go to closest iron mine, tell one cit to build settlement. Repeat step and tell one cit from other iron mine to do the same.
Group 3 cits from tower Shift click to hippo, do that with the other cits who are doing the other iron mine.
Make 3rd group Make another tower, either at forage, or closest hunt.
When possible, Make another 3 swords. when both mines deposit, upgrade attack of swords to 12, make another 3 swords.
make cit that is chopping wood, to make wall in little cracks.
Once you have 4 cits on wood, rally the other 2 to forage,
Shift Click the cits on the 4th tower to hunt aswell with the other 6.
Continue making swords, when possible make a cit and rally to forage till you fill it.
When you have enough wood, make 2 houses ASAP.
Keep upgrading swords/making swords/making cits
When possible make a farm.

I think that's it, my apoligies if I missed something

Tips:
When against cav?? 8fll is the optiumum time against cav, you're guarenteed to of out massed them, make sure you have the arrow bonus, and some extra hp and speed and dive into his base.
If you're against a good player you may need to do this: BECAUSE OF THOSE 4 CITS ALREADY ON WOOD, you can now make seige (I literlly just worked out what I was doing wrong since coming back when writing that Strat^). Make 4 ST, by 8fll you're ready to go.
If you're confident that you beat someone early on and they walled, most likely means they are booming and focusing on cits, not army. Make ST and jump the wall, before they can get back on their feet.
A trick when slutting. Don't press ctrl click. Press L to explore, a it's a little fraction faster, and when slutting it counts.
Against swords, draw sword units away with one or two swords from enemy iron mine then make 3-4 others go in a little after and kill almost all the cits or all of them.
When defending (Something I've failed even harder then slutting since coming back), put 3 or 4 swords by each mine and forage/hunt. (do this at the start if you need, just make sure first 3 go to enemies base and see if you can kill 2-3 cits on their tower or mines). When defending, I like to group cits with swords ctrl click, which group speed and swords to attack while cits move.

If you're against a boomer, especialy if somehow AOC revives and they use exp. keep massing, make hero by 15fll. It's another guaranteed win.

If I think of anything else, I'll add. It's a lot of info, hopefully someone finds it helpful.
The first few attempts, you may be slow and may not be able to do the shift click thing, quite as fast as should be expected of a seasoned player. Don't stress and keep practicing over and over again. As time goes by, you'll get better, you'll learn how to mass and boom.

Ask questions if need be,
Kind regards, herik
Last edited by herik on Mon Oct 24, 2016 1:26 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Arntzen
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Re: Middle sword Strat- herik

Post by Arntzen »

I'm certain this was just a mess up on your part but you can't afford both citizens speed and hp if you want all the other bonuses. The classic civ only uses speed.

Other than that your start is fine. I do 2 3 3 barracks instead of 3 3 2 though.

Honestly, I've never tried the explore trick for eco killing.. Might have to check that out! haha


Oh and here is Omega's post about swords (2009):
viewtopic.php?f=59&t=868
Here is mine (2010):
viewtopic.php?f=77&t=1876

All of these topics, including yours only really describe the first one or two minutes though, except for any tips.
A Good Place to Start: viewtopic.php?f=75&t=3884
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herik
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Re: Middle sword Strat- herik

Post by herik »

Yea that was my bad, I'll fix that up...I couldn't check, because I deleted ee...was getting too addicted.
The reason I've always done 3-3-2/3 is because that sword will come out a little extra fast then the enemy that does 2-3-3.
Taco taught me that trick, and I believe he told me his brother taught him that trick. He actually told me to keep it secret and for that reason not many people knew about it. However considering they've all left, and I'm pretty much non-exsistent in the games now, it was time for the ee community to have it revealed.
Yea, I really don't remember the rest of my strat now, had something to do with booming. But I don't remember now.

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Arntzen
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Re: Middle sword Strat- herik

Post by Arntzen »

If we're talking theoretically about a perfect start, I should have all three barracks up before the first citizen is out. So anything happening after the fact is insignificant.

In a normal game where lag is a factor and also human error like being a little slow at finding your iron mines or something like that. You're not fast enough to have the barracks up at approximately 30 seconds (out of memory I believe it takes 28 seconds to create 1 citizen). So sending the citizen from capitol to help out building a barracks will make it finish slightly faster.
Now, clearly going for a 2 3 3 is better because the barracks with only two citizens working on it should be built first since it will take them slightly longer to make it than the barracks with 3 on them. Rally the citizen to the first barracks with only 2 citizens and it will complete about same time as the two barracks with 3 working on them.

However in a real game I rarely rally the citizen to the barracks, I most often use this citizen to lure hippos. Still 2-3-3 is what everyone else except you (and maybe taco.. though I highly doubt he does 3-3-2). Lavanger did 2-3-3 last time I played him.
A Good Place to Start: viewtopic.php?f=75&t=3884
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herik
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Re: Middle sword Strat- herik

Post by herik »

Yea I can respect that. At the end of the day, it's MY strat, and the way I've always played. I played just as good as the others in the old days in the wing position, And either tied or was faster then their output of swords. But, yea I agree, people should try both way and see what works for them. When obsing you the other day against krass. I actually found your 7 cit strat interesting to build a settlement then go onto tower. It's quite an intelligent way to play, I would be interested to know the difference of speed of when Towers are built though.

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Arntzen
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Re: Middle sword Strat- herik

Post by Arntzen »

I'm not questioning if you played just as good other wing players, I'm questioning your claim about 3 3 2(3) being faster than 2(3) 3 3 which I simply can't see be the case. We're talking about a couple of seconds difference which, lets face it, isn't really a game changer.
Hence why I often do 7-7 iron, 2 2 2(3) rax:
7-7 iron is really more about getting a little faster iron than anything else. Also you have to shift-click the settlement builder to something else or you'll get 7 citizens working at each iron which is not good.. I believe towers should be up a little earlier, but again, we're talking a few seconds difference.
A Good Place to Start: viewtopic.php?f=75&t=3884
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herik
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Re: Middle sword Strat- herik

Post by herik »

I guess we have different opinions on it. From the many games I've played doing sword sluts, that extra second is a game changer (for me atleast). It could be the definition of arriving at their tower being built, it could mean the difference of how many cits you kill at the start. It could mean the difference of your oppentent having one or two safe mines. This therefore structures your whole game play for the first 5-10fll. Whether you mass or boom.
Yea I totally agree, I'de imagine you'de get a faster 2nd/3rd group of swords out. However I'de also imagine you lose a few seconds of tower built time, which could be the defining win or lose situation...If we're talking about someone that is equal level to you.

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